Adventure Cycling Association

Tom Butler: 0:04

This is the Cycling Over 60 Podcast, season 2, episode 16, the Adventure Cycling Association. I'm your host, tom Butler, if you are new to the podcast. I have been cycling for over a year now to try and get and stay healthy. This season is about taking on another challenge that I would never have thought I would do. I plan to ride 400 miles, starting in Anacortis, washington, and ending in Newport, washington, so basically across the state. Over this year I have struggled to improve my performance. I feel I need to be a stronger cyclist to do this 400 mile ride.

Tom Butler: 0:51

This week I got back on the bike for the first time in a few weeks. I have been off it since my continuous glucose monitor showed that riding hard spiked my glucose level. The good news is that my blood glucose did not spike during the ride, but the ride was pretty low intensity. So now I need to start adding more difficult and longer rides and then see if I can push harder without seeing negative results. Next week I'm going to do some 60 minute rides, see how that looks and then bump it up to 90 minutes. I think I will be fine now because this week has seen a significant improvement in my glucose levels. I really have my diet figured out so that I'm not spiking after meals. I'm making good progress towards being in the normal range now. Part of what is keeping my levels okay is the fact that I'm spending a lot of time on an exercise bike after meals, so I just need to swap out time cycling for time on the exercise bike.

Tom Butler: 1:48

I have what is referred to as the dawn phenomenon. That means that hormones are driving up my blood glucose early in the morning. In response, I started exercising first thing in the morning before I eat. I do 10 minutes of light intensity on the exercise bike and pushups and pullups. I can't do actual pullups so I modify them so I'm not lifting my whole body weight. It will be a huge accomplishment when I can actually do a full pullup. The number one reason I'm seeing better blood glucose numbers, I believe, is because I am losing weight. Unfortunately, I am still not seeing much change around my abdomen only a half an inch this week but I'm betting that putting in longer bike rides will change that. I would really like to drop the 10 minute exercise bike that I do in the morning before I eat and the 20 minute exercise bike after breakfast If I keep both of those. That means 30 minutes of exercise in the morning to add to a 90 minute bike ride. I also do 20 minutes on the exercise bike after supper. I don't have many days that I can afford that much time to just dedicate to exercise. I am hoping that one session of longer cycling will be enough to eliminate the other exercises, but we'll just have to see.

Tom Butler: 2:58

As I mentioned in the past, I've come to believe that insulin resistance is interfering with my ability to get oxygen to my muscles. I can't say that I noticed any difference on the bike this week. However, my intensity was low. I'm very curious about what I will see when I start pushing harder. However, I bet that I will not be seeing a big difference until I burn more visceral fat. That is something that is correlated with my abdomen circumference and what I believe is the biggest reason why I have insulin resistance. Now. I'm at 40 inches right now. I think even getting down to 38 inches will make a difference. I would really like to find some place that could measure my utilization of oxygen, so I wasn't just relying on my perception. Had some way to verify this theory I have that my muscles aren't getting the oxygen they need. I will certainly keep you posted if I find anything.

Tom Butler: 4:03

I have come across the Adventure Cycling Association from time to time and I've been really curious to learn more about what they do. Unfortunately, the recently hired Executive Director, jen O'Dell, agreed to come on the podcast. I was so excited to talk to her because I know that many people have gotten their start doing longer cycling trips because of the support provided by the Association. Here is our conversation. I am joined today by a really special guest, jen O'Dell, who is the Executive Director of the Adventure Cycling Association. Thank you, jen, for joining me.

Jennifer O'Dell: 4:34

Thank you, I'm excited to be here.

Tom Butler: 4:37

Now your bio states that you are excited to combine your marketing skills and passion for the outdoors for your role at the Adventure Cycling Association. Can you talk a little bit about your background and then also your role and what you work on there at the Association?

Jennifer O'Dell: 4:56

Absolutely Career-wise. I spent a long time in the corporate world in different industries, doing marketing for large CPG companies, some smaller family-owned businesses, a variety of industries, a lot of folks. During the COVID era, I spent some time reflecting on what's next. I'd been volunteering for many years for a nonprofit, both on the board and at a committee level. I had really been dreaming about how I can combine my passions and my desire to give back with some of the skills that I have. I was really thrilled to find this opportunity with Adventure Cycling, which brings my passion for cycling Specifically. I'm a longtime mountain biker, but bringing that and really being able to bring amazing experiences of the outdoors to new audiences out there, I was excited to be able to merge your passion and your professional worlds together in this way.

Tom Butler: 5:54

That's awesome when that comes together, for sure, absolutely. I'd like to ask this question of my guests what are your earliest memories of bicycling?

Jennifer O'Dell: 6:02

I love this question. I had to think back because I've had bikes, you know, since I was a little kid. But I think the earliest memory I have is actually being on the back of my dad's bike in one of those bike seats, and we were biking on a greenway by our house and there was a treed section ahead with a huge puddle in it, and so we stopped to get out to see if the trail was going to be passable and he set the bike up and put the kickstand down, with me still in the back, and I went and tipped over while I was still strapped in. I just remember it being wet and muddy and I don't know that we actually continued the ride after that, but it didn't stop me from getting back on a bike after that.

Tom Butler: 6:46

It might have been the moment where you're like, okay, I want to be in control of my own bike Exactly, I think I want my own bike now, dad. Did you know much about the Adventure Cycling Association before taking this position?

Jennifer O'Dell: 6:59

Yeah, so I was familiar with the organization. They've been around for almost 50 years. It's hard not to know about them and what they do, and my husband actually had purchased several of their maps at one point to plan a charity ride cross-country, and so we've poured over the maps and all of that as well. So, yeah, I mean I think what drew me to the organization, though, was at the time we were just getting started on some of our initiatives to really bring bike travel to new audiences and especially making it more accessible for people that are busy and need some shorter options or maybe don't know how to get started, and I found that to be a really exciting concept to be a part of and really help teach people how to get started in bike travel, because it's such a transformational experience and really wanting more people to be able to have that exposure and access.

Tom Butler: 7:54

So this is kind of a big question, but kind of briefly, how would you describe the goals that the association has?

Jennifer O'Dell: 8:01

I would say well, we have several goals In 2023, our goals this year were really to get focused on creating some of those new programs and opportunities to really teach people how to get started, while also maintaining a lot of the activities and programming that we've done for our members that continue to be a part of the organization, and so I'm really excited by some of the things that we've been able to accomplish this year. We have a new program called Short Routes, which is a writer-generated collection of beginner-friendly to advanced routes, and so they are anywhere from two to five days long, and we're still seeking submissions from our community so that we can continue to build upon that library of routes, and so that's just one example of something that we've been focused on this year to really help introduce more people and help get them started, because not everybody has time to set out on a cross-country multi-month trip, and so we recognize that and want to give people some options to plan a route that can be closer to home and take a little less time to do.

Tom Butler: 9:10

Well, I think that's important, especially looking back. I've really only been ramping up my cycling for over a year and in the beginning it was slow. It's slow now, but the progress is slow and having different routes. This season of the podcast I'm hoping to do a 400-mile ride across Washington, but it is a situation of ramping up a lot of things to get to a point and hopefully someday I'll go for a week and, who knows, maybe longer. Can you share about the formation of the Venture Cycling Association?

Jennifer O'Dell: 9:41

Absolutely so. The organization started in actually 1972 when there were four friends riding from Alaska to Argentina, so Greg and June Seyple and Liz and Dan Burden. Along the way, they came up with this idea of touring across the US to celebrate the Bicentennial in 1976. And they named it the Bicentennial. By the time that the fall of 75 came around, they had about a dozen staff members, including our four founders, who were creating this trail and this route to bike across the country, which became the Trans America Trail and our first official bike route as an organization. And in 1976, more than 4,000 cyclists took part in riding parts of that trail and following that success, we just continued to build and create routes and resources for cyclists and that eventually became the adventure cycling that we are today.

Tom Butler: 10:37

Looking back to the 70s, it was really a different time for bicycling than today. There was certainly limited in the 70s. Bike advocacy organizations were just beginning to form. Bike technology was vastly different and the fitness industry as we know it was just starting out as a counterculture movement. Issues of diversity and inclusion would have been mostly another radar recycling at that time. So would you characterize the founders as ahead of their time?

Jennifer O'Dell: 11:06

You know, I think people have been adventuring for years and people have also been riding bikes around the world since they were invented and you know, whether they're with different cycling groups for racing or just for fun.

Jennifer O'Dell: 11:20

But I think what our founders did was being able to take that drive to experience the world to a completely different level I think was very, you know, revolutionary at that point in time. And they created this movement, this national movement that created paths and routes and ways for other people to follow behind them. And so, you know, I think that that foundation was very lasting. You know, they've created a legacy and I would say that they've really were pivotal and pivotal and really making the industry what it is today and, you know, really kind of founding what we're now seeing emerging in a lot of places. As you know, the bikepacking movement and I think our founders were the original bikepackers and you know it's really exciting to see that come around again to another generation and see a whole new group of younger cyclists get excited about it. And you know, we're looking forward to continuing it for another 50 years, for the next generation as well.

Tom Butler: 12:24

I found it pretty interesting the role of graphic arts with the founders, you know, and to conceptualize things the way they did and to draw things out. I think that that was a great skill set to bring into this origin of a service for people. Now you're in Missoula, Montana, and I'm wondering if there is something about the culture of Missoula that makes it a good fit for an organization like yours.

Jennifer O'Dell: 12:53

I would say yes. Missoula is just one of those places where the access to outdoors is everywhere, and for some people it's literally right outside their door. You can access a trail up a mountain.

Jennifer O'Dell: 13:06

And you know, the community has put a lot of focus on creating spaces for different types of recreation outdoors, whether it's skiing or, you know, on the rivers, or hiking or cycling. There's a great cycling infrastructure in town as well and the community has all kinds of options for folks, whether you're a newcomer or a family, or whether you're an experienced writer outdoor enthusiast. So it really has embraced that culture and I think that that has helped continue the work that we do. But I've also seen that culture expanding in a lot of other communities around the country and so you know, I think we see our job is, you know, how do we really spread that culture around the country? So it's not just hearing Missoula.

Tom Butler: 13:50

The bike centennial, which I think is a cool name, so that really became an early focus. How have you seen the organization evolve since that time?

Jennifer O'Dell: 14:01

Yeah, you know, I think there's been some evolution and some things that really have been core to the organization still, and our routes continue to be a core part of what we do. Even, you know, building off of that first route with the Trans America, we now have over 50,000 miles of the Adventure Cycling Network and we have a route in every state. And then we've also continued to work with the US BRS, the United States Bicycle Route System, to work with government entities at the state and county level to designate those routes for cycling. And so, you know, routes continue to be foundational. But I think what we have seen in the last few years is really thinking about how people's lives have changed in the last few years and what we can do to provide that same level of access, but maybe in a more compact way. So, you know, many of us don't have a lot of time and creating those types of opportunities for access and resources, I would say, is kind of how we've been evolving, not necessarily what we do, but how we do it.

Tom Butler: 15:08

Gotcha.

Jennifer O'Dell: 15:08

And I would just say that's a big part of our work as an organization too to really you know you mentioned earlier talking about equity and inclusion and access, and you know that is front and center for the organization as well and really ensuring that we're creating opportunities for exposure and education and participation from everybody in the country, and so those are some of the programs that we're able to do that with.

Tom Butler: 15:34

You mentioned working with government organizations, community organizations, and it's really nice to see cycling and active transportation being championed, even, you know, embraced, but even championed as something that has a positive impact for people, and I think organizations like the Venture Cycling Association have been key to that getting people to resources they need, getting them on bikes and then having government officials, community leaders, see that in action. So I think that's it has fed it for sure.

Jennifer O'Dell: 16:07

Absolutely, and I think we're fortunate to have a large community in our membership we have over 50,000 members and being able to use those voices, whether it's with our own activities or those of our partners, to really help foster those important initiatives that are happening around the country. And we partner a lot with organizations like Rails to Trails and People for Bikes and really the League of American Bicyclists, and really feel like together, if we all work together, we can have a lot more impact, and so really supporting those organizations in their work as much as our own is an important part of what we do.

Tom Butler: 16:50

You mentioned some of the programs that you're working on now. Looking at some smaller experiences, I'm wondering if there's any other things that you're working on currently that you'd like to highlight.

Jennifer O'Dell: 17:02

Well, I would love to highlight some of the things that we've done in this. Last year with localized programming for our Bike Overnights initiative A great example. We have so many great stories, but we've been able to support different community groups and partners around the country and a couple examples that come to mind. We did a program with a elementary school in Austin and we were able to take a group of seven elementary kids that were part of a bike club on the overnight trip and for some of them it was the first time they'd ever been camping, and just to be able to give those students the opportunity and exposure to that type of activity firsthand is just a really great example of the impact that we can generate as an organization.

Jennifer O'Dell: 17:50

Similarly, there is another story with a group actually not too far from you in Portland Oregon called WeBike that we helped through our mini-grant program to enable them to take a group out on an overnight trip, and just some of the things that we heard from people that took that trip were about how they had the skills now to go out and do this on their own and they felt confident to be able to go out and bike travel on your own, and I think that's one of the biggest hurdles is how do you get started?

Jennifer O'Dell: 18:19

And it can be kind of overwhelming to plan and prepare for a trip and to just get out and do it, and so it's nice to be able to support organizations like that that can give people that firsthand guidance and really feel comfortable to just get out there and explore the world on two wheels. Human-powered travel is so exciting to be able to travel at your own pace and to you know, the things that you see on a bike aren't quite the same as when you're passing in a car at 80 miles an hour. So we just love being able to support groups and give other people that experience.

Tom Butler: 18:54

I love that thought of a bunch of kids on bikes going out for an overnight. You know like you said some of them you've never been camping before and what that experience must be like. That sounds like such a cool way of connecting. You know, and I'm even thinking of, like you know, we are cycling over 60 here and connecting multi-generations that way. I just think that's a really powerful image in my mind of seeing that take place.

Jennifer O'Dell: 19:25

Absolutely, and I think that's one of the great things about bike travel is that it is a multi-generational activity. Right, you can do with your friends, with your family, with your grandparents, right, like, depending on your situation. I've heard some stories from some of our members who are just really excited to have the opportunity to pass on the legacy of something that they love to younger audiences and to the next generation. We love being able to not only fulfill their own bucket list trips but to help them feel like we're creating that legacy.

Tom Butler: 19:59

Yeah, that legacy is something that grows. The organization still creates things and still grows. Do you have some thoughts about, as an organization, some of the things that you've seen, maybe in respect to working with community leaders or government organizations? Do you have some things that you would highlight as some of the impacts the organization has had?

Jennifer O'Dell: 20:25

There's definitely a big impact that we have had with individuals that take part in a lot of the guided tour programming that we do.

Jennifer O'Dell: 20:33

We typically run anywhere from 80 to 100 different tours each year, and so thousands of people have the opportunity to get out there in different places around the country and really experience what we talk about with this human powered exploration of the outdoors, and so I think being able to create those types of connections is just one of the ways that we generate impact and that we are excited about being able to be a part of that type of experience in people's lives, and so that's one, I would say. Continuing to maintain and update the routes and expand the US Bicycle Route system. I think creating access through experiences is a core part of what we do, but you need to have a place to go, you need to have a place to ride. You can't have the experience without it, and so continuing to support our cartographers and the work that they do to maintain our route network, while also work with different DOTs and other organizations to expand the US BRS, is just another way that we can bring that impact to the communities as well.

Tom Butler: 21:48

That's massive. I mean creating that kind of library that is bicycle specific and having that as a resource. I hate to say this. I probably should have gone out online and bought one of your maps, so I need to go do that for sure, Just to have that resource and such a. I mean you mentioned earlier how many network or bike networks you have. What's that number?

Jennifer O'Dell: 22:16

We have over 50,000 miles in our route network and the great thing about what our team does is not only are they mapping routes for people that are suited for bicycle travel, we're also looking for those services along the way that you need, whether it's food or lodging or bike shops or whatever you're going to encounter on your trip, really paying attention to the details of those types of services and including that in our routes and maps along with. There's even things like what's the typical weather like at this time of year, or just really things that to help you plan your trip and our staff are always well answering questions and emails as people are planning things that we have a really knowledgeable, passionate staff that really just want to ensure that people have a great experience and so love being able to help them have that journey.

Tom Butler: 23:16

Yeah, and in a nation where we're focused on cars, you know, when we think about transportation, we think about cars. What a great resource. The association is involved in projects all over the place. I'm wondering who some of your partners are.

Jennifer O'Dell: 23:30

Yeah, we have a variety of partners. Like I said, we have several partners in the nonprofit space that we partner with, such as Rails to Trails and bikepacking routes and people for bikes. I would say our from a US bike route system standpoint. Our partners are decision makers at local, state level, DOTs, different cycling advocacy groups and parks. We also have some corporate partners that support our mission directly, such as Exodus Travel and Bike Flights and Ortley, to name a few. And then we partner with a lot of different bike shops and bike clubs to support both their activities to go on routes, but also to spread resources and information about bike travel.

Tom Butler: 24:21

I think you have an interesting background for this question. I'm wondering if you could talk about why would a corporation be interested in the Adventure Cycling Association and becoming a corporate partner.

Jennifer O'Dell: 24:33

A variety of reasons, I would say you know in general, when you think about bike travel and the benefits of bike travel to an individual, a lot of people bike travel for a personal challenge, like you know. It's kind of like a bucket list item to them. But a lot of reasons that people continue to bike travel once they started is because of the physical and mental health benefits. It gives you something to train for and work towards and maintain your cycling kind of routine, but also having that mental health opportunity to just check out and unplug and be in tune with yourself for a while. So I think you know supporting whether it's your employees or broader communities in physical and mental health.

Jennifer O'Dell: 25:18

I think bike travel also has bigger impacts related to the climate, with pedal-powered travel. So, depending on the company, if that's something that you are interested in and support, I think you know we definitely exemplify that. And then I would say the last thing is also from an economic development standpoint. You know we've done some studies on the impact of bike travel to local communities and when you are traveling from city to city in some of these rural roads, like you, are reliant on the services that you come across and so there is a direct economic benefit for the communities that cater to cycling and support cycling, and so that would be another benefit that I would speak to.

Tom Butler: 26:02

I have seen some really interesting numbers about how much cyclists spend when they're traveling. That is something that can be built on as far as attracting communities to welcome cyclists coming through. I'm thinking about people on the road in some of the roads, I imagine are great. Some of them, I imagine, aren't as good, but it seems like, whatever the routes, there's this importance of safety. So I'm wondering what you guys think of as an organization when it comes to safety issues and, in a venture, cycling.

Jennifer O'Dell: 26:39

Yeah, well, I mentioned that we have a staff of cartographers that maintain our route network, and that's a priority for them is taking in information about what's happening on our routes and ensuring that they're updated as often as possible so that we're passing along that information to the community, and I would say it's interesting too.

Jennifer O'Dell: 27:00

We've also seen some emerging trends with more cycling in the gravel riding and off-road riding, and we have a combination of routes in our network. Some of them are on roads, some of them are on dirt and gravel, and the itineraries and the destinations whether it's in our routes or our tours that have more of those gravel and off-road offerings have been more popular lately than they have been in the past, and so I don't have direct data for this, but I feel like it's probably because there is a desire for people to bike in those areas because they do feel safer than others on the road, and so we've definitely seen the bike industry as a whole has seen big trends towards gravel riding, and so that's something that we're also looking at as an organization to see what else that we can do to help create more routes and opportunities in those areas as well.

Tom Butler: 27:56

I imagine because the number of years you guys have been around, there's many, many stories that focus on people that have participated different experiences with adventure cycling. Are there any stories that you've heard coming on as a executive director that kind of stick out that illustrate the fun people have or the growth people have when they're on an experience?

Jennifer O'Dell: 28:18

So many. I shared a few earlier with some of those organizations that we've been partnering with and I think I'm always amazed when I hear the stories about how surprised or not just surprised but also kind of reassured people are when they are out on a bike trip and they experience such a sense of community. And I've heard on a few occasions even people that come through our office on one of their tracks across the country about the people that they've met along the way and how nice and helpful and kind people are. And it's just a reminder that, despite what you might hear on the news, that people are good and we have such a broad community in this country of people that just want to support each other. And I think I'm always amazed that that is one of the experiences that I hear most often people talking about is the human interaction that they experience on a trip and the goodness and the kindness of people that are out there in the world, and so I love that.

Tom Butler: 29:25

Yeah, that is really wonderful. The story that I have about the Venture Cycling Association is that I was interviewing Bob Fletcher, who has written the book Octogenarian Odyssey, and he mentioned you. He mentioned the Venture Cycling Association as a great outfit that can help people get more comfortable with longer rides, and so I thought that was a pretty good endorsement. He's just finishing up a ride from North Pole, alaska, to Argentina. That seems like a pretty solid endorsement.

Jennifer O'Dell: 29:56

Yeah, yeah, we appreciate it.

Tom Butler: 29:59

I don't know if you've seen anything about his journey, but I think it's interesting because you talked about your founders as cycling from Anchorage to Argentina and I didn't think to ask Bob about this, but it'd be interesting to see if that was part of the inspiration that he had to do that trip. How would you recommend someone who has never done a long bike tour getting started?

Jennifer O'Dell: 30:25

Don't overthink it, Okay good.

Jennifer O'Dell: 30:28

I would say that I would say start out with a night or two and go somewhere, try out your gear, figure out what works for you and build up that confidence. But just get started. Just do it and don't overthink it, and find a buddy. There are so many people out there that love to do this activity. We have resources to connect people with other writers, and there's lots of clubs and groups and, of course, we have guided tours and things like that for people as well. But if you feel like you don't want to do it on your own, there's lots of resources out there to help you get started. If you do want to go on your own, we could help with that too.

Tom Butler: 31:08

I do think for me to do a week-long trip. I would love to be connected with people who've done it before, because I think there's a lot of things that I just wouldn't think about. Also, I'm not sure I'm quite ready for a week of bike camping.

Jennifer O'Dell: 31:24

Yeah, yeah.

Tom Butler: 31:26

So I'm good with following a route that takes me to towns.

Jennifer O'Dell: 31:30

Absolutely Well. That's the great thing about bike travel is you can camp if you want, or there's plenty of options to create a route where you can stay in a hotel every night or every other night, or there's also organizations out there like Warm Showers, which is an online resource where you can find places to stay in people's homes if that's something that you'd like to do as well.

Tom Butler: 31:54

That's cool. I'll have to put a link to Warm Showers in the show notes. Yeah, warmshowersorg Do you see older people taking on cycling challenges.

Jennifer O'Dell: 32:04

Absolutely. It's amazing how many people I've seen begin their cycling journey either as soon as they retire or as soon as the kids leave the house, or the kids get involved in their own activities. It's often a turning point in people's lives. It's so inspiring for me to meet people when they get started. I'll say last summer I went on one of our tours and it was one of our introductory tours, One that's where we teach people how to pack their bike, what gear to bring, all of those things. Then we go out on a couple of day adventure and we camped the whole way.

Jennifer O'Dell: 32:44

There were a couple of people on that trip that had never done it before. It was just great to hear their experiences. Most of them were older than me. It was just great to hear their stories. I'm glad that we're able to provide those types of resources for people to get started and feel comfortable and just jump in with a group and know that we're there to help answer your questions. There are no dumb questions. I had my own dumb questions as I was figuring out how to get stuff on my bike for that particular trip. We all learn a little bit more every time we do this. There is not too late to get started.

Tom Butler: 33:20

What do you think about e-bikes? Do you think that's unlocked opportunities for people?

Jennifer O'Dell: 33:24

Absolutely it has, and we have been looking at how we can create some more e-bike-friendly options in our tours. We have a few tours where we have places where people can charge, because that's the biggest challenge, I think, if you are doing a more remote trip, it's just finding a way to charge your bike up. In general, I think e-bikes have definitely unlocked that, not just for older audiences, but, I think, just people just not really comfortable with their cycling abilities too, or being intimidated by cycling. E-bikes just makes the activity so much more accessible for a lot more people. I think it definitely has.

Tom Butler: 34:04

On the October 20th episode of the Cycling with 60 podcast focused on Chicago, I interviewed John Lastovica. He's a retired marketing professor from Arizona State. I asked him what is the message that you think would get more people out on a bike? I'll ask you that same question what do you think the message is that could attract more people to spend more time on a bike, either as a transportation alternative or a recreation alternative? How do we motivate people to do that?

Jennifer O'Dell: 34:38

I think there's a great motivator in giving people an opportunity to slow down the pace of their world a bit. We're all pulled a million directions right now. A lot of us have really fast paced lives with lots of activities. The great thing about cycling whether you're commuting to work or going on a weekend trip is that it allows you to really slow down and be present in the world around you. I think that's a great motivator. I would say it doesn't even need to be something that you have to commit to on a daily basis. Even just once a week makes a huge impact in your life and the world around you.

Tom Butler: 35:18

I love that answer. I think that dovetails with what you talked about earlier about the community. I think there's an aspect you go on a trip, things slow down and it gives that space to really get to know people and to develop that community. How about somebody who wants to support your work as an organization? How could they contribute?

Jennifer O'Dell: 35:37

Several ways. We are looking for contributors to our short route network. If you're already a cyclist and you have a favorite route, we'd love for you to submit it so we can include it in our library. You can become a member or donate. There's lots of different opportunities for that. I would say in general sign up for our newsletter and we'll continue to share ways that you can support either our organization or others, whether we're helping out someone else with some of their advocacy efforts or if we have new information to share about programming that's coming your way. Sign up for our newsletter and we can keep you connected.

Tom Butler: 36:18

Awesome. Well, jen, thank you so much. I'll end here by asking you what are some of your personal cycling challenges coming up? Do you have anything fun on the horizon?

Jennifer O'Dell: 36:29

Well, since it's November not in the near horizon these days I would say it's less about my own personal bucket list than more about how I can introduce my kids to adventure and things that we can do as a family. I'd love to take my younger kids on an overnight. My two youngest boys have been my mountain bike buddies since they could get on a Strider bike and we did our first backpacking trip this summer. Now I'm ready to merge those together and take them on a bike overnight. That will happen next summer, once we have some non-snowy weather here in Montana.

Tom Butler: 37:08

Now do you see bikes with balloon tires and spike tires out and about in that area?

Jennifer O'Dell: 37:15

Absolutely. Several folks in our office commute even on the icy days with their spedded spike tires and fat bikes. Absolutely, in Montana you have to either embrace the world around you and just go with it, or you hold up for the winter, definitely. I definitely see a lot of that.

Tom Butler: 37:34

Again, thank you so much, Jen, for coming on. This has been awesome. I really appreciated learning more about the adventure cycling association. I really look forward to jumping online and get some route information from you guys.

Jennifer O'Dell: 37:49

Tom, thanks so much. I really appreciate you having me on the show. If you need anything when you're planning your trip, don't hesitate to reach out.

Tom Butler: 37:57

I will for sure. Thanks again. Have a good day.

Jennifer O'Dell: 37:59

Thank you.

Tom Butler: 38:10

I'd say the Adventure Cycling Association has found a fantastic executive director to steer them into the future. I loved all the times that Jen talked about the community element of cycling. I did get online and found that they have a map of US Bike Route 10, which is the route I plan to take for this season's challenge. It is section one of their northern tier route from Anacortis, Washington, to Bar Harbor, Maine. That is a 4,294 mile trip. I won't be doing that. Section one is from Anacortis to Sandpoint, Idaho. I don't plan to go all the way to Sandpoint for now. I plan to stop in Newport, Washington, which cuts 30 miles off from going to Sandpoint.

Tom Butler: 38:53

Jen's comment on people continuing to do long events as they get older got me thinking about something. I am wondering if cycling for several days could function somewhat like a fast. Fast are recommended for people with insulin resistance because it pushes the body to use energy stored as fat in the liver. I've come to believe that it is this liver fat that is the biggest factor for insulin resistance, but I bet a week-long cycling trip would do something similar. I need to get some information on how much fat the body burns on a long bike ride. I would be worried about cycling for long periods of time in a state that burns a lot of fat without carbohydrates. However, over a week I could maybe cycle in and out of this condition.

Tom Butler: 39:34

I hope that you learned something new about the Adventure Cycling Association that you didn't already know. Let me know if you have used them before or if you are inspired to get out on one of their routes. You can find my email and the show Instagram link in the show notes. Please send me a message. You will also find links to WarmShowersorg, the League of American Bicyclists, and people for bikes in the show notes. Whether you are riding short trips from home or going on a long route in some faraway place, I hope you are enjoying all that cycling has to offer and remember age is just a gear change.